CommunityNews

CommunityNews

There’s No Such Thing as Clean Code

Everyone seems to be striving for ‘clean’ code at the moment. You can’t read a blog post without the author telling you how clean their approach is. Engineering teams get together and discuss which of the possible solutions is the cleanest. Other developers assure you that they practice ‘clean code’.

I’ve come to a realisation though. There’s no such thing as clean code.

Read in full here:

https://www.steveonstuff.com/2022/01/27/no-such-thing-as-clean-code

This thread was posted by one of our members via one of our news source trackers.

Most Liked

davearonson

davearonson

Not exactly “no such thing”, more like quite the opposite, “too many things”. :slight_smile: Somewhat like “quality software”, tossed around with mostly no definition, or occasionally too many definitions. (That’s why, in the spirit of XKCD 967, I’m making One Definition To Rule Them All – results so far at Codosaurus: ACRUMEN .)

dimitarvp

dimitarvp

Quite true.

I personally read “clean code” as “something I can pick up in 5 minutes if I haven’t touched the code base in a year” which is IMO a good pragmatic way of looking at it.

But too many people have been living in poverty, became programmers and skipped five social ladder steps in the upwards direction… and then super quickly became insufferable snobs that started writing bullshit like “clean code aesthete” in their biographies. :person_facepalming: (Yes, I’ve actually seen that and was flabbergasted)

The older I get the more extreme I become. Our area needs a serious cleanup. :expressionless:

davearonson

davearonson

(Sorry for the delayed reply, I’m catching up after a week of vacation!)

Yes, good clean code would be easier to pivot with… but in the time it takes for the business side to decide what to pivot to, the dev side can get started cleaning up the code a bit, plus there’s a fairly large chance that the whole codebase will get chucked and rewritten anyway, or that the biz will just go totally bust and not have a chance to pivot into anything.

As for monoliths, yes, it’s an argument for doing things the easy way. Building a monolith, whether majestic or not, is much easier and faster than deciding where to split things up into microservices, and figuring out how to make them all communicate properly. You can certainly start it as a monolith, and tear off chunks to be microservices later. Again, yes, this will be easier with good clean code… but that’s an investment that you might well not have a chance to cash in. You can also tear off chunks in just a conceptual manner, and reimplement the code differently, perhaps more cleanly this time (since it will probably last longer this time).

But that does bring up an idea… maybe a framework based around microservices in the first place? Say for instance we started with Rails but added microservices for various common things to add on, like various kinds of user management, especially authentication and profiles, maybe authorization, into microservices. Or provided a common foundation for making microservices, so if you needed to split off a service for certain kinds of PII or PHI or credit card data or anything else sensitive, or anything else that might otherwise make sense to split out, you could start that microservice from a common basis, much like how so many apps start from the basis of Rails. Think that might be useful?

Where Next?

Popular General Dev topics Top

First poster: dpritchett
It’s not what programming languages do, it’s what they shepherd you to. How many of you have listened, read or taken part in a discussio...
New
First poster: bot
MEMORANDUM FOR SENIOR PENTAGON LEADERSHIP COMMANDANT OF THE COAST GUARD COMMANDERS OF THE COMBATANT COMMANDS DEFENSE AGENCY AND DOD FIEL...
New
First poster: dyowee
Everyone seems to be striving for ‘clean’ code at the moment. You can’t read a blog post without the author telling you how clean their a...
New
First poster: joeb
The File System Access API with Origin Private File System. WebKit supports new API that makes it possible for web apps to create, open,...
New
First poster: bot
Raspberry Pi security alarm — the basics. In November last year — I started building a DIY security alarm system, using a Raspberry Pi a...
New
First poster: bot
Hector Martin (@marcan@treehouse.systems). Attached: 1 image For those wondering why the hell we need all this safety system stuff for...
New
First poster: peterchancc
Why I like Clojure as a solo developer | Biff. Most of the reasons fall into a few categories: data orientation, the JVM, and the REPL.
New
CommunityNews
Christian Mills - Testing Intel’s Arc A770 GPU for Deep Learning Pt. 2. This post covers my experience training image classification mod...
New
First poster: DevotionGeo
To avoid being replaced by LLMs, do what they can’t. What LLM’s can’t do yet
New
CommunityNews
We’re a tiny team @deepseek-ai pushing our limits in AGI exploration. Starting this week , Feb 24, 2025 we’ll open-source 5 repos – one ...
New

Other popular topics Top

DevotionGeo
I know that these benchmarks might not be the exact picture of real-world scenario, but still I expect a Rust web framework performing a ...
New
dasdom
No chair. I have a standing desk. This post was split into a dedicated thread from our thread about chairs :slight_smile:
New
AstonJ
Continuing the discussion from Thinking about learning Crystal, let’s discuss - I was wondering which languages don’t GC - maybe we can c...
New
PragmaticBookshelf
Create efficient, elegant software tests in pytest, Python's most powerful testing framework. Brian Okken @brianokken Edited by Kat...
New
PragmaticBookshelf
Rails 7 completely redefines what it means to produce fantastic user experiences and provides a way to achieve all the benefits of single...
New
AstonJ
If you get Can't find emacs in your PATH when trying to install Doom Emacs on your Mac you… just… need to install Emacs first! :lol: bre...
New
PragmaticBookshelf
Build efficient applications that exploit the unique benefits of a pure functional language, learning from an engineer who uses Haskell t...
New
New
PragmaticBookshelf
Build modern server-driven web applications using htmx. Whatever programming language you use, you’ll write less (and cleaner) code. ...
New
RobertRichards
Hair Salon Games for Girls Fun Girls Hair Saloon game is mainly developed for kids. This game allows users to select virtual avatars to ...
New